Removing old Thru-Hulls and Seacocks

One of the things I knew about Windsong when I first saw her was that all of the seacocks needed to be replaced ASAP. They are very old-school style Groco seacocks and all have corroded to the point where they are inoperable. What does that mean? If a hose were to leak, I would not have had a way to shut off the thru-hull and the boat would probably sink unless the hose or seacock was plugged.

Seacocks are meant to be the #1 insurance on the boat against sinking, and I didn't have that insurance for the entire time I owned the boat in the water. Since I started the bottom job I have been contemplating how the heck to get the seacocks and thru-hulls off the boat. They were so corroded that unscrewing the thru-hull from the seacock was impossible. I spent many months contemplating my approach and did as much research I could on the subject. Unfortunately there aren't many articles written on how to get this job done on old, corroded equipment. There are plenty of articles on how to take apart modern seacocks, but non on how to tear apart old ones with no hope of reuse.

I did, however, find a few blogs and forum posts from people who just cut the thru-hulls up with a Dremel or some other tool to help remove them. But with my limited experience in doing things like this, I really needed a step by step instruction on how the heck to do that. After some creative thinking and experimentation, I finally figured out how to do it and here I will show my process.

Here are the seacocks in the head with hoses removed. One is the sink drain, another is for the head itself, the other was unused with no plumbing coming from it.

Here are the thru-hulls attached to these seacocks

Each seacock has two bolts that go through the hull that needed to be removed. My dad and I began this job back in May by removing the hoses to the seacocks and the bolts that go through the hull. Once we reached that point, we were stumped as to how to remove the thru-hull from the seacock. So after my research I took a stab at cutting the thru-hulls to remove the mushroom head so I could just pull the seacocks out from the inside.

I removed the three thru-hulls from the head seacocks before I got down there with the camera, so the sequence below shows the thru-hull from the galley sink. As you can see, the two bolts are still attached so I wasn't able to actually remove that seacock until I get a second hand, but the process is still shown.

First, using a cut-off wheel on my Dremel tool, I made a series of cuts to create some pie wedges. For the bigger thru-hull in the head, I needed to make a few more slices.

In my research I learned that bronze is a pretty soft metal, so cutting and bending is quite easy. In this next step, I hammered a scraper/chisel under one of the slices and pulled down to bend the slice outwards a little bit, enough to fit the back of a hammer under the slice.

With the hammer under it, pry the piece right off. The pieces pried off surprisingly easy.

Repeat the process for each slice until all you have left is a the clean shaft of the thru-hull in the hole.

At this point I went inside and removed the seacock by just pulling it out. One seacock just fell off after cutting the mushroom, one needed to be pried off with the back of the hammer, and the other just needed some muscle to pull out. Here is the head area with all removed:

Outside:

Inside (thats a flashlight in the middle):

Old seacocks. You can see how corroded they are, no hope for the valves to turn. They are not the newer style Groco seacock with a locking nut on the base.

After figuring out this process, removing these things is a piece of cake. I'll need some help to get the remaining seacocks unbolted, but I am no longer worrying about the process when comes time to start fairing and repairing the bottom.

I'll be using these articles as reference to install new thru-hulls and seacocks (links):

Seacock and Thru-Hull Primer

Replacing Thru-Hulls and Seacocks

Seacock Backing Plates

Back from a break

I have been travelling for the past week and a half, most of which spent in the Seattle area for a friend's wedding. It was a blast and I loved all I saw of the Pacific Northwest. Once all the pictures are sorted through I will post a write-up of the trip for all to enjoy. But for now its back to work unfortunately. It feels like forever since I've been on Windsong to do any work, so hopefully I can commit to getting some things done this week.

When I last left Windsong I cut open some larger sections of glass on the underside of the cabin rooftop to expose the wet core. The little section I took out in the previous post seemed to dry out pretty easily after just a few days of exposure. I wanted to test this on a larger scale and get an idea of how far the dampness went in from the handrail holes. As you can see in the pictures below, the darker area of the core is the dampness and ends less than a foot away from the holes. The area on the sides where the windows are did not get wet as it is a separate core piece. If I go back to the boat and find that this exposed core has dried out well enough, I plan on just cutting out the entire damp area, letting it dry out for a while, then patching it up with some glass.

I have gotten so many differing opinions on how to deal with this damp core issue ranging from leaving it be to completely gutting the core and repairing. I've decided to go an intermediate route by drying it and patching the glass. Leaving the core wet might not be horribly detrimental, but it would surely cause mold and mildew problems, and might delaminate the deck if the water inside froze. The differing opinions of marine repair seems to be a common trend, and a finely worded quote from a fellow blogger Jon Vigor sums it up well:

"The distinguishing mark of a yachtsman is that he never, ever, accepts advice from another yachtsman. He has to learn for himself the hard way, by bitter experience, again and again. I think it’s probably Nature’s way of keeping the numbers down, so that the anchorages don’t get too crowded."

Deconstruction

Nothing too exciting has been going on these past couple of weeks. Since reaching the finishing point on the hull below the waterline, I've turned my attention to the deck and interior. I've been working my way from bow to stern disassembling everything in my path.

So far I've completely gutted the v-berth in the cabin. Before Windsong was even out of the water I had began to remove teak trim and cabinetry and have started the refurbishing of those pieces. These past few weeks I spent time removing the remaining trim, tearing out headliner and the old strips of wood it was attached to, chipping off old formica, ripping out foam insulation in lockers, and generally clearing the space out.

Aside from interior destruction, I've begun to remove all deck hardware. Once old hardware is removed, I will pot all holes with epoxy to seal leaks and prevent core rot in the future. Removing the old hardware is difficult in some areas, particularly the teak handrails. The bolts used to hold them in are very stuck and it took a good amount of effort to get them out. Eventually a boat yard friend showed me the wonder of an impact driver and I ordered one immediately to help speed up this process. Looks like those teak handrails will need to be replaced due to lack of upkeep and accidental damage trying to remove them.

There aren't many interesting pictures of this process. But I've been trying to take pictures of whatever I take apart so I can have a guide while putting the puzzle back together. If you are interested in the pictures of dissassembling Windsong, feel free to browse this gallery:

Disassembling Windsong

My new West System epoxy kit should arrive this week and I will begin to pot the hardware holes soon after. I plan on following the process shown here (click link). I'll try to do some good photo documenting of the process for the blog.

Project - Bottom Job - At a stopping point

I've reached the first major milestone in the restoration of Windsong!! wooooo!

I finished grinding off countless layers of antifouling paint, the entire gelcoat, and blisters a-plenty. With everything ground down to bare glass, the hull can now dry out for the remainder of time we are on the hard. I'll come back whenever I am done with all other boat work to fill the blister depressions and other areas in need of repair, fair the entire hull, apply the epoxy barrier coat, and paint. I ended up opening around 80-90 significant blisters on the entire hull, and countless little ones. You can see in the pictures all of the blister holes. It was evident that this boat was in PRIME conditions for blisters and water damage in the hull: warm, fresh water and the paint had not been renewed in over 10 years. The paint blistered first, trapping water between the paint and gelcoat; then over time the water absorbed into the gel coat and into voids between the first two layers of glass. I might elaborate on this eventually, but right now I'm just happy all of the nasty grinding and sanding is finished.

You can see in the pictures how good the gelcoat is on the rudder. If only the rest of the boat was like that, I would have a lot less work to deal with. But from the looks of it, whoever made the boat did not do a good job laying up the glass on the hull, causing voids and blister problems.

Now I will turn my attention to the decks and interior work. My primary goal in this next phase is to remove all hardware from the deck and seal all holes with epoxy, eliminating all deck leaks and preventing core rot. I'm sure I'll find all sorts of surprises in this process, including some bad areas on the deck that may need re-coring. In between doing that work I'll continue to disassemble the interior. Yesterday I decided I wanted to start pulling all of the old bilge pumps out of the deep keel bilge and attempt to get it dry. I opened up a can of worms finding old hoses that led to nowhere and all sorts of junk in the bottom of the bilge.

I can be happy that the most grueling portion of work is done with though. Grinding the bottom for two months straight in the Florida heat was not fun, but it needed to get done.

Bottom Job drags on

Since the last update I've continued focusing on the bottom job, and I am only a few days away from finishing the main grinding of the port side. I usually work Monday through Thursday after work until dark. Weekends have been on hold until I am fully settled in here in St. Augustine. I couldn't work all last week due to travelling for work, my first week without getting anything done.

I had some technical difficulties with my grinder two weeks ago so I spent that week sanding the previously ground starboard side down smooth with a 5" random orbit sander using 40 grit pads. This smoothed out the grinding marks and faired the hull somewhat. I am about 2/3 done grinding the port side. Once grinding is finished, then I'll give it a good sanding and I'll be done with the hull for a while.

Starboard side after grinding down to bare glass and sanded smooth

Port side grinding progress:

Space man at work

Project - Bottom Job con't.

I finished grinding the starboard side today

Took approximately 40 hours, mostly 3 hour shifts after work till dark. Hopefully I can finish the other side quicker with what I learned on this one. Opened up about 40 blisters as well. It is difficult and boring work. Holding the grinder above the head and away from the body is hell on the shoulders and back, but my endurance is getting better. This is probably the worst job of the whole rebuild, glad it is over halfway done.

Project: Bottom Job

Since hauling Windsong out of the water I have been focusing most of my energy on her hull below the waterline. My goal was to get the hull to the point where it could dry out for the rest of the time on land. This would mean removing paint and the gel coat (if necessary) and then leave the hull alone while I worked on the rest of the boat. Fiberglass boats do in fact absorb water through osmosis (what creates blisters). The hull needs to be completely dry before I apply the planned epoxy barrier coat (protects against water absorption) and then paint.

I had researched many different ways to remove paint from the bottom. The most common choices are to sandblast, grind, use a chemical peeler, or just old fashioned muscle and scraper. I opted for the simple method of scraping with a cheap paint scraper from Home Depot. The bottom paint was loose enough where the majority of it came off with the scraper. I would scrape a section of hull then go back and sand away the remaining paint down to the gel coat. I started at the bow on the starboard side and worked my way back.

Here is the hull after the first weeks work:

Removing the old paint to the gel coat revealed quite a few small spots where fairing compound was used in some sort of repair. It also revealed the blisters I feared would be present. The worst case scenario in my mind were thousands of small blisters all over the hull. But what I discovered were isolated, larger blisters averaging about 3-4" in diameter (some larger some smaller). When I found a big blister I would drill into it with a countersink bit to release the fluid inside. The fluid is some sort of gross acidic chemical that smells very distinct and shoots out at high pressure. It is always fun to pop them, but I always seem to get the stuff all over me. I would drill a pattern of holes all around the area of the blister so they would drain completely, and could be flushed out with ease. Cleaning and flushing the blisters with fresh water removes salts, chemicals and other nasty stuff that slows drying time.

Drilled out blisters. You can also see all of the old repairs/fairings:

Small blister completely ground out:

Another small blister, and even smaller ones showing the poor condition of the gel coat

I determined that the blisters needed to be ground out completely until I reach undamaged glass. Since these are deep and large, I will need to build the leftover hole up with layers of glass before fairing compound.

Ground out blisters below. I have yet to bevel and shape the ground out blisters completely for repair, only ground out to dry:

After scraping and sanding for a week or so, someone at the boat yard saw me struggling with my scraper and going slow as molasses. He recommended that I use a pressure washer with a special nozzle attached to really blast off the loose paint. I did so and was able to get all loose paint off (most of it!) with only an hours work with the hose. This was fantastic compared to the slow slow work of the scraper.

Unfortunately the blasting revealed many areas where the gel coat was in such bad shape it just chipped away. Some areas where it chipped away revealed more blisters and hydrolysis (water damage) in the first layer of glass. After wasting a week working on sanding down to the gel coat, I know accepted the fact that the gel coat needed to be removed completely so that the glass underneath it can dry out.

Here are some pictures of the hull after the pressure blast:

So I re-tooled and began to grind away the paint and the gel coat underneath it down to bare glass, grinding out any blisters or evidence of hydrolysis I came across in my path. I've been experimenting with many different pads for the grinder and have settled on using a 4 1/2" rubber backing pad and 36 grit disks. Most of the time it comes out pretty even, but I'll have to go back over the entire hull with my random orbit or palm sander to get it nice and flush.

Here is the hull after a week or so of grinding. I started the port side when I came to work on the boat early on a Sunday, the sun was on the other side so I switched to the shady one :)

By the end of this week I should be over half way done. Once fully ground off, I'll leave the hull to dry out while I turn my focus above the waterline, the deck, and the interior.

Once most of the projects above the waterline are out of the way I'll follow this procedure to finish the bottom job:

-Sand entire hull smooth

-Repair deep blisters and any other major damage (keel) with layers of glass

-Fill and fair small blisters and gouges until smooth

-Apply epoxy barrier coat

-Apply anti-fouling paint

THE Project List

THE Project List

♫Dun dun dunnnnnn.....♫

What I have here is the project list for Windsong. This will be an ever evolving list, and even now is only a quick outline of things I anticipate in the near future. If one thing I have learned from other boat owners is, the list never ends. But this is the near-term list of things I hope to get done in the next year or so.

1. Before leaving Inglis:

-Remove as much interior woodwork as possible
---Begin refinishing wood - clean, strip, sand, varnish
-Begin any other prep work (remove headliner, cleaning, remove rotten bulkheads, etc.)
-Seal portlights with some silicon to temporarily stop leaks. - done
-Put all safety gear on board - jackets, flares, fire extinguishers, first aid kit
-Get dinghy on board

2. Before transport to boat yard:

-Remove Mast (please comment on Mast Removal, I need to do it soon so I could use some advice)
---Remove sails (how do you remove the roller furling?)
---Secure or remove running rigging
---Remove booms & hardware
---Remove lower spreaders
---Cut/undo mast-head light & instrument wiring
---Attach crane
---Remove uppers
---Remove Mast

-Take down bimini, dodger & frame
-Remove hardware (lifelines, stanchions, etc.)
-Empty tanks
-Secure everything inside
-Winterize E (would it be a different process if it is Summer)

3. In Boat Yard:

Bottom & hull
-Remove bow decorative piece
---Refinish or replace piece
-Scrape or grind off paint to gelcoat
-Grind out & clean blisters
-Let hull & blisters dry out
-Inspect propeller, shaft, cutlass bearing, etc.
---Repair, Refurbish or Replace as necessary
-Inspect and rudder
---Repair, Refurbish or Replace as necessary
-Clean, dewax and sand hull above the waterline
-Repair any damage
-Apply epoxy barrier coat to hull-side and bottom
-Apply white paint to topsides
-Apply paint to top stripe (green or blue???)
-Apply anti-fouling bottom paint
-Paint bootstripe
-Apply name

Topsides
-Remove headliner to access hardware
-Remove all deck hardware
---Polish/Refinish or replace hardware, service winches & windlass
-Remove all portlights
---Order new windows (where from?)
-Remove steering column
---Refinish wheel, binnacle & compass.
-Remove cockpit instruments and panels
-Remove teak handrails, captrail, bowsprint & trim
---Clean, sand & refinish teak (how to finish: varnish, 2 part poly, or leave bare)
-Clean, de-wax & sand decks
-Repair core damage
---Known problem areas: cockpit sole, under mast
-Grind cracks
---Dremel tool
---Fill & fair deepest cracks
-Apply epoxy primer (all at once or tape off non-skid areas and do separately?)
-Paint bare areas white
-Paint non-skid off white or beige
-Seal hull to deck joint
-Attach all teak pieces & seal where necessary
-Re-bed all hardware (rigging, stanchions, etc.)
-Attach steering column
-Re-bed cockpit instruments

Mast & Booms
-Remove all hardware & rigging
---Inspect, refinish or replace as necessary (wire & hardware, spreaders)
-Remove all lights, instruments wires (leave messenger line)
-Clean running rigging
-Clean, sand and paint mast & booms
-Attach all hardware and rigging
-Attach new instruments & lights
-Run wiring
-Raise mast & rigging to finished deck
-Assemble booms & hardware
-Attach sails

Finishing touches
-Make new or repair all canvas (sail covers, bimini, dodger)
-Attach bimini & dodger frame & canvas
-Attach sails
-Launch!

Interior projects
-Remove & refinish all wood (trim, doors, cabinets, companionway stairs)
-Remove all rotten bulkheads
---Repair or replace bulkheads
-Remove all laminate tops
-Inspect galley systems (refrigeration, gas & stove)
---Repair or replace
-Remove all old wiring, leave messenger lines where necessary
-Remove all old plumbing (pipes, pumps, head, sinks, water heater, strainers)
-Clean all tanks
-Engine
---Remove large parts, remove rust, re-paint
---Replace all hoses
---Refurbish raw water strainer
---Maintenance as needed
-Clean out chain locker
---Figure out locker options (lead to under berth? how to seal off?)
-Clean & sand all surfaces & lockers
-Clean bilge
-Paint all surfaces (formica or paint bulkheads?)
-Install new plumbing
-Install new wiring & electronics
-Apply new formica surface tops
-Install trim, bung, varnish
-Install cabinets, doors, companionway stairs

And so on, and so on....

January Projects

In my time off I have been busy stripping and sanding various pieces of woodwork from the boat. I spend a few hours a day working on it and have developed a good rhythm and process to prepare the woodwork for varnishing. I ordered some Interlux Compass and Goldspar Satin varnish and will begin to apply them this week. As you can see below, I have a box full of cabinet doors, trim, all 3 doors and a few other random pieces already done. I went back to the boat this weekend with my friend Jeff to gather more wood, as I had finished prepping all the wood I had. We have pretty much completely removed all wooden pieces from the v-berth and I can start to feel the progress.

Stripped and sanded wood, ready for varnishing:





The v-berth, mid wood removal. You can also see that I've removed all of the headliner as well:



This past weekend I also sealed up the portlights (windows) with some silicon sealant. This is a temporary measure to eliminate leaks until I start to remove and replace everything. All of the windows leak so something needed to be done until I could replace them.



So this week I have quite a bit more wood to strip and sand, but will also start the varnishing. I am excited to see some finished product after all of the hours I've put into the woodwork. A lot of the pieces will need to be re-installed on the boat before I can finish them, as they need to have bungs (wooden plugs to hide the screws) installed before finishing.

I also cleaned up and tested out the 9.5 foot Achilles dinghy that came with the boat. It isn't pretty, it's quite ugly in fact, but it floated well and has no serious leaks. Jenny and I took it out onto some local lakes around downtown Orlando and had some fun afternoons lounging around on the dinghy and relaxing on the water. I purchased two paddles from the Sailor's Loft in St. Augustine and they work great with the dink. You can row it quite well like a canoe with two people. I owned two cheap rafts as a kid that I would paddle around Doctors Lake off of the St. Johns river. They were named the Otter, and Otter II; so naturally this one gets to be deemed the Otter III.

The dink on the banks of Lake Ivanhoe:





Relaxing as the wind sails us back to shore


Good view of the city (and a very fine Jenny as well):